Comments on: Mount Otsego, Part 5 http://www.pickinsplinters.com/2009/06/19/mount-otsego-part-5/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=mount-otsego-part-5 There's always room for one more on the bench. Fri, 10 Feb 2012 13:56:27 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Burkester http://www.pickinsplinters.com/2009/06/19/mount-otsego-part-5/comment-page-1/#comment-5183 Burkester Tue, 23 Jun 2009 02:23:33 +0000 http://www.pickinsplinters.com/?p=3563#comment-5183 Chas- I actually put Robinson as my number one because I've been hearing so much hype about him. Have you been hearing as much as I have about how he's going to be in a legends poker tournament this fall? Chas-

I actually put Robinson as my number one because I’ve been hearing so much hype about him. Have you been hearing as much as I have about how he’s going to be in a legends poker tournament this fall?

]]> By: Wally http://www.pickinsplinters.com/2009/06/19/mount-otsego-part-5/comment-page-1/#comment-5182 Wally Tue, 23 Jun 2009 00:42:26 +0000 http://www.pickinsplinters.com/?p=3563#comment-5182 Nope ... that's cuz everyone seems to agree with me. Hah ... jk :) Nope … that’s cuz everyone seems to agree with me.

Hah … jk :)

]]> By: Chas http://www.pickinsplinters.com/2009/06/19/mount-otsego-part-5/comment-page-1/#comment-5180 Chas Mon, 22 Jun 2009 16:46:33 +0000 http://www.pickinsplinters.com/?p=3563#comment-5180 I think we can factor in the parks that guys played in. I don't think we should hold it against Boggs that he was really good at going the other way at Fenway, but if a guy played in all hitters' parks (or all pitchers' parks) in his career, we can take that into consideration. The trouble we run into is it adds another subjective element, like comparing players from completely different eras, but that's pretty much what this is all about. That is, unless we use stats that adjust for ballpark factor...but we won't go there. :) Regarding the Yankee thing, if you're going to hold the stadium against Babe Ruth, then you should also think about what death valley did to Joe DiMaggio. I guess that's an example that shows how difficult it is because the stadium was certainly a hitters' park to Ruth, but a pitchers' park to Joe D. Casey -- Ken Boyer belongs in the discussion as much as, or more than, Graig Nettles does. It looks like Schmidt, Mathews, Robinson and Brett...this one's not nearly as controversial as SS, huh? I think we can factor in the parks that guys played in. I don’t think we should hold it against Boggs that he was really good at going the other way at Fenway, but if a guy played in all hitters’ parks (or all pitchers’ parks) in his career, we can take that into consideration. The trouble we run into is it adds another subjective element, like comparing players from completely different eras, but that’s pretty much what this is all about. That is, unless we use stats that adjust for ballpark factor…but we won’t go there. :)

Regarding the Yankee thing, if you’re going to hold the stadium against Babe Ruth, then you should also think about what death valley did to Joe DiMaggio. I guess that’s an example that shows how difficult it is because the stadium was certainly a hitters’ park to Ruth, but a pitchers’ park to Joe D.

Casey — Ken Boyer belongs in the discussion as much as, or more than, Graig Nettles does.

It looks like Schmidt, Mathews, Robinson and Brett…this one’s not nearly as controversial as SS, huh?

]]> By: Chas http://www.pickinsplinters.com/2009/06/19/mount-otsego-part-5/comment-page-1/#comment-5178 Chas Mon, 22 Jun 2009 14:14:03 +0000 http://www.pickinsplinters.com/?p=3563#comment-5178 That's a really good question, JD. In these types of discussions Pete Rose generally gets lumped into the left field category. I'll admit to going along with that, without really knowing exactly why. He played more games at first base than left field, but he played considerably more games in the outfield than first base, and left field was his primary outfield position. So, that's probably why. It was suggested by Wally earlier in this thread that we create a utility category for players who didn't really have one regular position and DHs. I would say that Pete Rose would be a prime candidate for this, as would Paul Molitor, Frank Thomas, Craig Biggio, Rod Carew, Edgar Martinez. I suppose Robin Yount could have as well, but we gave him the nod at SS. I haven't really discussed this with Smitty, but it seems like an idea we'll probably go with. So, that may be where Pete Rose fits into the discussion. That’s a really good question, JD. In these types of discussions Pete Rose generally gets lumped into the left field category. I’ll admit to going along with that, without really knowing exactly why. He played more games at first base than left field, but he played considerably more games in the outfield than first base, and left field was his primary outfield position. So, that’s probably why.

It was suggested by Wally earlier in this thread that we create a utility category for players who didn’t really have one regular position and DHs. I would say that Pete Rose would be a prime candidate for this, as would Paul Molitor, Frank Thomas, Craig Biggio, Rod Carew, Edgar Martinez. I suppose Robin Yount could have as well, but we gave him the nod at SS.

I haven’t really discussed this with Smitty, but it seems like an idea we’ll probably go with. So, that may be where Pete Rose fits into the discussion.

]]> By: JD http://www.pickinsplinters.com/2009/06/19/mount-otsego-part-5/comment-page-1/#comment-5176 JD Mon, 22 Jun 2009 00:53:58 +0000 http://www.pickinsplinters.com/?p=3563#comment-5176 Scmidt Robinson Matthews Brett - for all of the things already mentioned plus he seems like a great teammate. I am wondering where Pete Rose fits in this discussion. Scmidt
Robinson
Matthews
Brett – for all of the things already mentioned plus he seems like a great teammate.

I am wondering where Pete Rose fits in this discussion.

]]> By: Wally http://www.pickinsplinters.com/2009/06/19/mount-otsego-part-5/comment-page-1/#comment-5175 Wally Sun, 21 Jun 2009 19:13:44 +0000 http://www.pickinsplinters.com/?p=3563#comment-5175 Smitty -- That was a tongue in cheek comment about Boggs hitting at Fenway. I was just looking for anything to fend off Chas. Seriously, though, I do like Brett better. As Casey aptly pointed out, Brett was simply GREAT for 8-9 years as an all-around player, possibly the best on the game over that stretch ... or at least in the AL. Smitty –
That was a tongue in cheek comment about Boggs hitting at Fenway. I was just looking for anything to fend off Chas. Seriously, though, I do like Brett better. As Casey aptly pointed out, Brett was simply GREAT for 8-9 years as an all-around player, possibly the best on the game over that stretch … or at least in the AL.

]]> By: Rey http://www.pickinsplinters.com/2009/06/19/mount-otsego-part-5/comment-page-1/#comment-5174 Rey Sun, 21 Jun 2009 02:12:47 +0000 http://www.pickinsplinters.com/?p=3563#comment-5174 I was almost sold on Pie Traynor. We should only penalize New York Yankees for the short porch in right. Everyone else and their respective home ballparks are fine ;) I was almost sold on Pie Traynor.

We should only penalize New York Yankees for the short porch in right. Everyone else and their respective home ballparks are fine ;)

]]> By: Smitty http://www.pickinsplinters.com/2009/06/19/mount-otsego-part-5/comment-page-1/#comment-5173 Smitty Sun, 21 Jun 2009 01:48:55 +0000 http://www.pickinsplinters.com/?p=3563#comment-5173 For me it is Schmidt, Robinson, Mathews and Brett. I agree with the honorable mention going to both Chipper Jones and Wade Boggs. I also hope we are not going to start penalizing players for the ballparks they play in. Just because Boggs utilized Fenway Park to his advantage, doesn't minimize him being a great hitter or his place in regards to all-time third basemen. If Boggs is penalized, does that mean Yaz and Ted Williams are penalized for hitting in the same ballpark? Does Ernie Banks get penalized for hitting in the "friendly" Wrigley Fields. Certainly a bunch of his home runs were added by that warm summer breeze blowing out. Or does Babe Ruth get penalized for a short porch in right field? Boggs was a great hitter and actually was by all standards (higher fielding pct. and over 800+ more chances) a better fielder then Brett. Wally, I do agree with you, in that the you should look for more power & RBI production from the hot corner. That is where Brett has Boggs. Overall, much closer in my mind between the two, but Brett sticks out just a little more. For me it is Schmidt, Robinson, Mathews and Brett.

I agree with the honorable mention going to both Chipper Jones and Wade Boggs.

I also hope we are not going to start penalizing players for the ballparks they play in. Just because Boggs utilized Fenway Park to his advantage, doesn’t minimize him being a great hitter or his place in regards to all-time third basemen. If Boggs is penalized, does that mean Yaz and Ted Williams are penalized for hitting in the same ballpark?

Does Ernie Banks get penalized for hitting in the “friendly” Wrigley Fields. Certainly a bunch of his home runs were added by that warm summer breeze blowing out. Or does Babe Ruth get penalized for a short porch in right field?

Boggs was a great hitter and actually was by all standards (higher fielding pct. and over 800+ more chances) a better fielder then Brett.

Wally, I do agree with you, in that the you should look for more power & RBI production from the hot corner. That is where Brett has Boggs.

Overall, much closer in my mind between the two, but Brett sticks out just a little more.

]]> By: Casey http://www.pickinsplinters.com/2009/06/19/mount-otsego-part-5/comment-page-1/#comment-5163 Casey Sat, 20 Jun 2009 20:12:10 +0000 http://www.pickinsplinters.com/?p=3563#comment-5163 Schmidt - as as kid I found him boring. Now, I realize his greatness. Robinson - I would have to go through a mind eraser to not put Brooks on the list. Mathews - hard to dispute those numbers. Brett - From '77 -'85 was there a better all-around hitter in MLB? He only won one Gold Glove and I don't remember any great defensive plays by Mr. Pine Tar Incident. Growing up, Brett and Andre Dawson were my favorite players. Does Ken Boyer deserve mentioning? Schmidt – as as kid I found him boring. Now, I realize his greatness.

Robinson – I would have to go through a mind eraser to not put Brooks on the list.

Mathews – hard to dispute those numbers.

Brett – From ’77 -’85 was there a better all-around hitter in MLB? He only won one Gold Glove and I don’t remember any great defensive plays by Mr. Pine Tar Incident. Growing up, Brett and Andre Dawson were my favorite players.

Does Ken Boyer deserve mentioning?

]]> By: Gino http://www.pickinsplinters.com/2009/06/19/mount-otsego-part-5/comment-page-1/#comment-5162 Gino Sat, 20 Jun 2009 17:59:17 +0000 http://www.pickinsplinters.com/?p=3563#comment-5162 Schmidt, matthews, Brett, Robinson. I might change my picks during the week though, cause I can't find a reason not too pick Wade Boggs. If Molitor was a third baseman in my eyes, I'd pick him. But I see him as a DH. Schmidt, matthews, Brett, Robinson. I might change my picks during the week though, cause I can’t find a reason not too pick Wade Boggs.

If Molitor was a third baseman in my eyes, I’d pick him. But I see him as a DH.

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