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Open Thread Thursday (2/26)
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Wow, no open thread thursday topics. I guess Wally’s Mt Rushmore post stole the show. 57 comments!!! Is that a clipboard/bench record?
Here’s one: Are Celtics fans ready to embrace Manny Marbury? And, did I just insult Manny Ramirez by that comparison?
Without checking – 57 is probably a record. Of course 49 of the comments were made 4 people, and only 8 different people commented in total – we have had more than that on a few occasions. I have my viewpoints on those numbers. Save that for another time.
Manny Marbury – oh boy!!!! He does realize that he will still be coming off the bench – right? Chances are he’ll play …10-15 minutes per game – right?
I was going to put this at the end of the Mt. Rushmore thread, but I’ll save you the scroll time:
As for me ‘trying’ to be different’ – when I originally read Wally’s post my mind started racing. My first reactions were (in this order): Orr, Jordan, Ruth, Mays…and…and. Was that the purpose of Wally adding on the fifth person? To make me ponder? So I went back and looked at Wally’s description. What stuck out was the line: “most meaningful to YOU.”
So I got to thinking. While Jordan is the greatest to ever lace up a pair high tops, how much did that actually mean to me. For me to have a personal Mt. Rushmore WITHOUT a representative from Duke basketball would be a lie. If we had this discussion in 1995, I would have put Grant Hill on that mountain side. But that doesn’t work too well in 2009.
While thinking of my Duke rep I considered several others. At one time Joe Altobelli was on my Mt. Alto was the coach of the Rochester Red Wings for most of the 70s. If you would have asked me in 1975 who my heroes were, Alto would have been second only to Bobby Orr. I was a fan of the SF Giants until Mr.* came to town. The whole reason was Alto who left Rochester to coach the Giants.
OJ Simpson came to mind – the 70s, western NY, 2,003, etc. etc. …ride in a Bronco. ‘Nuf said.
As I stated in the thread, Sugar ray Leonard came to mind. I loved boxing in the 70s and early 80s.
For a short time David Wottle was up there as was Mike Bossy, Moses Malone, and Joe Frazier – to name a few.
Then I asked myself which sports have been most important to me? For a period of time – probably 15 years – if you asked what my favorite sports were, I would have answered in this order: College Hoops, Tennis, and Hockey. And it hit me – it would be a lie for me to NOT put McEnroe on the hill. McEnroe’s career bridged the two greatest eras in tennis. He played against the greats of the 70s – Borg (a guy who could be on that Mt.), Connors, Vilas, etc.. Then he competed against guys like Lendl and Wilander before the coming of Sampras, Agassi, Courier, Chang, and Cash. Put aside his behaviors and watch an old video of McEnroe. He did things on the court that nobody could do. There was no one who could cover a tennis court like him and still be able to play a power game when needed. Within the past year McEnroe and Sampras played an exhibition that was televised. I happened upon it while scrolling through the all too many channels that we have. There were other sporting events on at the same time, but I watched that match to catch a glimpse of McEnroe past.
(Yes Pete I realize I am putting that era or those eras over Smith, Ashe, Laver, etc.)
So for me – McEnroe and Coach K had to be on the Mt.
The crazy thing for me about that thread? All those comments and not one mention of Bill Russell or Wilt Chamberlain. Hmmmm…..
You make a good point about the personal nature of it. I originally made note of the open-ness of Wally’s idea, but then got lost in the idea that it needed to be the most iconic figures in sports. So, that said, my personal Mt. Rushmore:
Reggie Jackson – never my favorite Yankee, but this is going to be about those who’ve played the biggest roles in my teams’ championships, so it’s got to be Reggie for the 77-78 Yanks.
Joe Paterno – I don’t think I need to explain this one. He brought a national championship to our school while I was a student there, and is the greatest coach in the history of college football.
Wellington Mara – to me, he’s more important than Parcells, although that’s probably debatable.
Joe Torre – some may consider him over-rated, but he did skipper four World Series champs in five years.
Mariano Rivera – gotta pick him over Jeter as the player who was most valuable in the 1996-2001 era.
Chas – I have no problem with the Celtics aquiring Marbury. There is one non-statistical categoryto consider: the guy loves basketball and has had that love rejuvenated. He’s been away from the game for a long time, and now probably has that same middle school feeling to play again. That will be a little extra enthusiasm for Boston. I don’t believe much that comes from him, but I do believe him when he says that he’s hated sitting out. I think it really started to get to him and he rekindled that competitive flame.
Now – the real question is will he fit in? I think so. Rondo is the man and has become a true point guard – totally unselfish and completely in tune with his teammates. Pierce remains the go-to guy and. Eddie House is a great shooter and I think a very smart player, but he doesn’t have the ability to attack the lane. When House and Marbury play together, it becomes a defensive challenge to me. And, watching clips from last night, House looked for Marbury cutting to the basket on more than one occasion. A great complement to his outside shooting ability.
Also – this honeymoon won’t tire. We’re well past the midway point and I don’t think there will be time for Marbury’s attitude to truly saturate as it did in New York. As far as a short term aquisition – it’ll work out for this year at least.
I also believe the comments on the quality guys in the Celtic locker room. They tasted success last year and seem to have bought into the Celtic Mystique. Last year there was some interviews or conversations between Garnett and Russell on TV. I may have been fooled but I thought I saw some geniune repsect given to Russell from KG. Not something seen very often in this day and age. I am not sure he or the other players of the team will allow Marbury to mess that up. I think he will tow the line. I think he will fit in. Perhaps most importantly, I also think that with his ability he will carry the team in a few games and win the Celt’s a few games they may not otherwise have won.
Also, winning takes care of a lot of issues.
Moss had something of an attitude adjustment when he went to Pats, so I guess there is hope for the same with Marbury going to the Celts. But he is so out of character with what they have brought in to rebuild, and they have been so successful. That success is the only thing that makes me think they may have got it right. That organization has made virtually no mistakes in the past 2 years. Doc says it’s a strong locker room that will mold Marbury. I hope he’s right. I’m no NBA fan, but I have enjoyed seeing the Celts return to the top. It makes me think of the good old days.
Chas –
I wasn’t sure, but I highly suspected before that you were a Penn State alum, given your fondness of JoePa in recent posts. I don’t happen to agree that he is the “greatest coach in CFB history” … I would think he’d have to win AT LEAST another NC to be in the discussion, but I lean more toward quality than longevity … I just can’t let your assertion slide by without challenge. There’s a few guys with 3-4 National Chan’ships on my list before Paterno. JoePa is great … just not THE greatest in my book.
As I said over in the Mt. Rushmore thread, let’s leave Rockne vs. Paterno out of this, but as a Notre Dame alum Wally, I would think you would appreciate the fact that student-athletes at Penn State and Notre Dame are truly student-athletes, unlike at schools like Florida State, Miami, Oklahoma, etc. That’s gotta count for something, and it also helps explain why such programs–and you can appreciate this better than anybody–have their share of peaks and valleys.
Chas –
I admire any college coach, or institution, that really tries to keep the “student” in “student-athlete” … so you’re right … that’s another great thing about Paterno. It does count for something … at least in my book. And yours.
JoPa has survived the valleys at Penn St better than he would’ve at ND. Recall … Lou Holtz was forced out after a couple “mediocre”, yet winning seasons. He won a NC and should’ve won a 2nd in ’93 if not for the “Bowden Career Appreciation award”. Anyway, things have changed under the Dome … apparently the leash is quite a bit longer for Weis than it has been for others. I think the Penn St admin is infinitely more patient than ND’s when it comes to football. It comes back to pressure as well … ND has burned out several great coaches … most cannot last more than a decade (e.g. Ara Parseghian). It has just been easier to fly under the radar at Penn State over the decades. Paterno IS Penn State football.